I am going to try to get to grips with a subject that tests and vexes a great many people. The horribly difficult issue of Israel. My postbag has attracted some quite judgemental and cruel comments regarding this issue and, sadly, nothing of any substance or reason (biblically or otherwise).
I have to be honest, this is an area I struggle with at a number of levels and for a number of reasons and am more than happy to be 'informed' of errors (nicely please) but don't fancy the prospect of more of the 'you are cursed because you oppose God's people' stuff!
Today
As I see it, the issue of Israel is coloured, and even hampered, by the modern nation state (a secular place) and the overly indulgent attitudes of Zionists. The spiritual people of God, the heirs of the promises and those who bear God's name don't appear to be the same people as the modern secular Jew. Just because it's called Israel doesn't mean that God sees the same label. Some will scream about Israel being merely about 'possessing the land' and tell me it's all about territory.
When I was younger, I used to assume Israel was a land full of God-fearing Jews, but the more I became engaged with it, the more I realised that the conflict between secular and 'religious' Jews was engaged and that it was becoming an increasingly secular nation. An assumption that is perhaps supported by the fact that Israel's Proclamation of Independence doesn't even mention God (although there is a passing nod to the ‘Rock of Israel’).
Israel ‘will be based on the principles of liberty, justice and peace as conceived by the Prophets of Israel; will uphold the full social and political equality of all its citizens, without distinction of religion, race, or sex; will guarantee freedom of religion, conscience, education and culture; will safeguard the Holy Places of all religions; and will loyally uphold the principles of the United Nations Charter’.
Excellent - but of course the words ring a little hollow when we think of many of the realities (outside of Palestine and Mordecai Vanunu), but that's true of all nation states I reckon. But there are requirements from God that need to be maintained, and of course they ain't. Still, this could just make them a sinful and fallen nation couldn't it?
Modern Israel is about Jewish nationalism, not the Jewish faith and not about the spiritual nation of Israel, heir of the promise. The conflicts between the various Jewish interests, ultra-orthodox, orthodox, middle of the road, reform, liberal and the like all add to the mix, and to the conflict. Then there are groups like the Haredi who feel the nation state is a denial of God's promise to Israel because it's linked with obeying commandments, which secualr Israel not only isn't, but appears to break with impunity.
Influences outside of Israel don't help. The support of America and the whole spectrum of Zionists offering support for as biblical people, condoning the nation's action and raising funds to rebuild the temple all complicate an already complicated political and national picture and supports what, unkindly, some have described as a self-serving, Godless, ghetto mentality.
And then we have the American fundamentalists (like Phelps, Jones and Sapp perhaps) who offer unconditional support as well.
See my difficulty (and we haven't even started yet!)?
Pax
ps. And then there's God's people!
8 comments:
Your blog shows you to be an anti semite and a disgrace to the calling you claim to have.
Those who oppose the people of G-d will be thrown down and will be trampled such that it will be as if they and they offspring never were.
"Woe to you when all men speak well of you, for that is how their fathers treated the false prophets."
Lk 6:26 says it all I guess.
I must be one of the most blessed people I know in that case!
And I haven't even started on the human rights abuses!
In fact I haven't even started really, just made sure we knew where I was writing about.
Pax
Working a lot with Israel i see things slightly different, though sympathise with your point of view.
I think the fact they were 'given' a nation says something in the modern world.. to see this as less ten a gracious act of God weakens somehow, despite the ungratefulness of man. Something that is kind of difficult to figure out until you read Hosea - the prostitute that can not be forgotten.
The promised heir that despite their utter disgraces, Jesus and Paul were truly hopeful of their return, a return that is promised in truth in the end - despite all the perversions, including a rejection and a nailing to the cross of their messiah who came first to His own.
And on a personal level, first hand of working and travelling there - there is something powerful. Something deeply involved. Something beyond the surface that can not be ignored or forgotten that goes beyond the secularisation of today, or the physical location. There is an underlying presence and drive - yes, I would even say a calling - and the fact that they are surrounded by people who wish for their eradication says something that is truly 'evil' and suggests that something, somewhere sees them as a threat more than mere bombs...
too think there is something more than that which lies on the surface.
Israel was a special place for me (us) to visit and . . .
Well, the jury is still out - this is a dialogue rather than a pronouncement, so let's see where we end up.
Thanks Dean
Yes, I understamd modern Israel is rather secular - but (while I personally regret that fact) that doesn't mean they don't have a right to defend themselves against Islamists who have a very-explicit aim of permanently and totally destroying Israel/all Jews. And their secularism doesn't mean we should for a moment be influenced by the duplicitous Western MSM which is endemically biased against Israel and in support of its enemies. I don't believe that the return of Jews and the creation of their state heralds the promised end of times, but again, that doesn't mean we are wrong to stand up for their right of self-defence.
Greetings,
Good post.
I've read your post thrice and find nothing bordering on Antisemitism. I would also note that the modern State of Israel has been subjected to extraordinary libels. In my view, the reasons for this are simply that Israel is modern, western, democratic state and it's neighbors are stuck philosophically in the first Millennium A.D.
That said, I think your distinction between the Biblical nation which inherited God's promises through Jacob and it's relationship with the geography and Christendom is something which continues to vex both Christians and Jews alike. Like it or not, these questions do have theological roots. There's an entire wing of Christianity which holds the modern nation/geography are inseparable from the people and therefore that support anything that the Nation of Israel does. See, "dispensationalism."
Regards.
I have no problems with Israel as a modern, secular nation, and as such I also have no problems with them defending themselves against other nations.
The problem is that so many people appear to ignore the secular nation state and make it some spiritual giant. They talk of God's provision and God's this and God's that but ignore God's commandments for His people and His call on them.
I, ironically perhaps, do find myself defend the 'spiritual' israel quite often, but not the nation supported, underwritten and excused by many, especially though I guess, the US government and the religious fundamentalist evo's.
Thanks for comments - looking forward to seeing where this journey of exploration takes us.
Pax
I think there are many of us who would call ourselves Zionists who do recognise that Israel is a secular state and like any other country she is perfectly capable of making mistakes.. I do however believe she doesnt make as many as she is accused of. I believe that Israel will be established as a state ;as she is , before christ returns, But i do believe from my interpretation of scripture that A reminant will call out for Christs return, she will say "blessed is he who comes in the name of the lord".. I do struggle to believe that the church has replaced israel.. we have been grafted in, "..Could a mother forget her child, even if she could , Oh israel I could not forget you".. as of yet Israel is like a wayward child, he blinding is temporary, She will return, or at least a reminant will return, I think of it like if my child went of the rails, i wouldnt stop loving them , I would long for them to return to the right path and would want my other children to long for their return also, not turn their backs and reject them just because they fell...... also , Zionists are not required to invest in the rebuilding of the 3rd temple, the building of the temple is just a fact, a politial sign of the time before the return of Jesus., as I believe from the book of Daniel, that the anti-christ will plonk himself down in it, stop the sacrifice and announce himself king and the only one worthy of worship... 31/2 years before jesus returns.
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