The United Kingdom and the EU - Lunatics and Asylums

It seems to me that I, as someone called pastor and uphold truth, have a duty to get involved with the issue of the EU and our nation's continued membership - something I have struggled to avoid if I am being honest.

The reason for this decision is based upon the number of engagements and the high degree of xenophobic, jingoistic and irrational attitudes contained in them; fortunately none of them have been from to date, so here's the beginning of a few blog entries to remedy that.

But before we start to try and develop some sane, balanced and (for me, most importantly( biblically balanced dialogue with the issues, let us consider some of the reasons I have heard thus far with regard to leaving the EU:

LEAVE

1. We would be safer with regard to terrorism,

2. We wouldn't have to obey European Law,

3. We wouldn't have all 'those' foreigners coming here and getting benefits,
4. We would control our borders and stop people we didn't want entering the country,

5. We wouldn't have all 'those' foreigners coming here and taking our jobs,

6. We would be better off as an Independent nation - we are Britain and the US and Commonwealth
    would stand by us,

7. We would be able to trade more freely,
8. We could spend the money we spend on being a member of the EU on schools and the NHS,
9. We could decide what is right without  'Europe' telling us what to do because of human rights,
10. We wouldn't have to worry about the curve on a banana (really!) or what to put on boxes,
11. We would keep our sovereignty and our monarch 

12. We could still drive on the left.

REMAIN
1. Better the devil you know,
2. It was called a common market for nothing - new trade agreements would take time and cost us
    money and lose us jobs,
3. Having a seat at the negotiating table is better than being a small 'has been' piddling island,
4. Being part of the European community AIDS trade, security and peaceful existence,
5. Leaving Europe would not change the authority of the European Court and the laws it passes or the
    verdicts they pass down.
6. If Nigel Farrage, Boris Johnson, Michael Gove, Zac Goldsmith and Ian Duncan Smith want us to
    leave then that's probably a good reason to stay in,
7. The obvious hypocrisy between the Scottish referendum's 'Better together'  campaign and the
     'Better alone' EU position needs no discussion - just the call to remain is enough,
8. No tariff trading and open access to Europe, the UK's biggest market says it all,
9. What membership of Europe costs is less than 10% of what we pay on the NHS - that's good value
    for money,
10. Sovereignty and our own right to rule is upheld and supported by being a member of the EU,
11. Two choices: small offshore island or major world influence - staying supports the latter.
12. Leaving might stop some from working in this country but would see our nationals hampered
      likewise should they wish to work in Europe.

So there we have it - so much misinformation out there, so many people playing on what is nothing less than the racist and xenophobic tendencies of many and few asking the 'What Would Jesus Have Us Do?' Question.

Watch this space - be prepared to bring positions, information and facts and balance.

Pax 

UKIP and Immigration: A conversation

I happened across an image of the UK with the words I have added to my version below from UKIP which was accompanied by the words in the caption:

NHS, schools overcrowded, 2.2million jobless, 

wages depressed, houses unaffordable 

CONTROL IMMIGRATION 

My response to this was:

Immigration: Something we ought to have though when we ruled the waves - poor show to waive the rules now!

Enough is enough, at the point of being overwhelmed, there now ceases to be a host community to integrate into.

Guess you're not a Londoner! 
I'm not happy with economic migration but where place of safety is required then we've a moral duty and since we've joined EU, until we leave, transfer of workers is part of package And so I guess the cultures that make our society what it is will have to remain to come, and remain, too!
But what do I know, I'm only fourth generation Cockney :-)Pax

The following questions were asked, but time, space and other factors meant that I copied them and will try to address them here:

Why do Muslims seek "a place of safety" in UK EU US and then seek to change these societies fundamentally?
Throughout the history of our nation we have become home to a number of nations ranging from Jews during the European diaspora past Wirurush and passing the  Bengalis of the 70's  and the Eastern Europeans of today. Each brings their own culture and each gathers into small enclave of national identity at times - and then they integrate into the society and dilute the concentration.

I can understand the concern you have with the issue of Islamic migrants because of those who despite being born here see themselves as something other than British and the discomfort felt when those who reside here speak of conquest and islamification of our land. 

The actions of ISIS militants against Christians and other 'infidel' in Iraq and the radicalisation of those who come to this land from the islamic faith are indeed issues for concern but they need to be addressed in a rational, measured and  open-handed manner - avoiding the developing of racist and antagonistic mindsets that mirror closely the fascist approaches of the thirties (and we know where that led don't we?).

Immigration is a reason for supporting @UKIP every nation has the moral duty of putting the welfare of its own people
Totally right. Every nation has a duty of care towards its citizens - it also has a duty to provide places of safety for those who need them and to welcome workforces from places who will come and work, pay taxes and contribute to the well-being of the nation in which they reside. Those who come and add to the burden that welfare and health care presents with nothing but the view of gaining benefits and healthcare and abusing the system should be dealt with accordingly. But again, the issue of balance and reason have to come to the fore and be presented in ways that do not encourage xenophobic attitudes.

Immigration is a mistake to believe we are in a condition of equilibrium as far as immigration we ain't seen nothing yet?
Now this is one I struggled with as 'equilibrium' in this setting means (I reckon) that we have similar numbers entering and leaving and so the population is run with some status quo situation. I'm assuming you think we will be seeing many more coming in than leave (regardless of nationalities) and  are in danger of being swamped. I can but agree that we do need to rationalise this situation - so how do we put barriers up so that, car park like, every time someone exits the bar is raised to admit another?


Immigration is a real question of justice to the host communities worldwide people do not have a human right to trespass
Again I agree - the right to migrate to another nation is an issue of balance and mutuality and to assume that you have the right to set up home where you like is something that will leave you rather disappointed (I know, I've been looking at how picky some nations are when it comes to letting people settle in their country). The issue of justice is one of great concern to all and not one to be taken lightly.

And there it is, my responses to the immigration issue as it hit me yesterday.

It's a kneejerk response rather than something read about and developed (which I will now do) and is something I think ALL Christians need to have a view on. Here begins my journey.

Pax

How far we've come since Hitler

I find it so sad to see so many people live in a world where revenge rather than justice is the goal.

To find so many people who know their rights and, strangely, ignore their wrongs!

Where my rights trump yours and the views of those who dislike what we like - those who choose not to choose what we do - those who have the audacity to reject what we embrace - their views are merely tossed to the ground.

And those who embraced what we didn't embrace are vilified and spoken against and labelled.

A world where the views of the many outweigh the views of the few and the needs of the poor, the sight of war, the visions of need, are ignored as we merely change channel to see . . .

Britain's got  . . . EVERYTHING!

Except, of course, the poor - the homeless - the broken - the beaten and dispossessed.

That's what so many think is the truth - And our politicians, they help us with this: After all, who wants to live next door to a Rumanian (other than another Rumanian perhaps?)

Why do we let these people in? The politicians I mean, not the Rumanians!

meanwhile - back at the hustings they tell us how it's about time that we closed our borders - issued orders - locked up the foreigners - beat up the Jews - disposed the 'phobics' and run this country for 'us' (whoever 'us' might be) and made things work in favour of the nationals not the foreigners!

After all - 'the struggle for domination will be fought entirely between us and foreigners - all else is facade and illusion.' (well that's what Hitler said on the way to coming to power).

How our society has come on since then!

Football and the race rows

I don't know about other people but I am becoming a little alarmed that Luis Suarez is handed am eight-match ban for racially abusing Patrice Evra when the only evidence that appears to have been prersented is from Evra himself! Now I'm not questioning Evra's account but am questioning the fact that he apparently abused Suarez (in his own language and by his own admission) such that it elicited the response for which he (Suarez) has been punished!

It seems to me that both players need to be facing bans for their behaviour and the FA, whilst trying to make a grand gesture are on the road to making yet another spectacle of themselves. Mind you, if the Crown Prosecution Service are successful in their forthcoming court appearances with Chelsea and England Captain John Terry, also on racist comment charges, I can only assume he will lose his place in the England squad and face an even lengthier ban. Ironic when you consider that the English FA went and appealed against Rooney's ban (for a blatant and ridiculously typical'rooneyesque' foul which merited the punishment given) because it was in their interests. But what about the interests of fair play and integrity? No even a hint of such things :(

Seems racism is not OK (which is the right position to take) but cheating and behaving contrary to the laws of the game is. Double-standards or what?

Yes indeed - a game of overpaid, loose-moraled, prima donnas with even more dodgy types gracing the governing bodies (or was FIFa just a blip) who set duplistic standards and somehow still manage to fall short of them.

Still, the good news is that it will help to rekindle the almost maniacal hatred between the two teams involved which has to be good for the next meeting of the two (if you like to see police officers kept busy that is).

we need to be robust about dealing with bad behaviour, all bad behaviour, not just that which suits us or benefits us at the expense of integrity.

Pax